Then what is it then. Only the government agencies, military forces, etc. should be allowed to have such weaponry?
Yes fuck over the private citizen by creating a massive gap in technological availability and sheer inequality.
Don't get me wrong, I don't believe "everyone on the street should have a gun" I believe that those who possess the intelligence, maturity, and discipline required to commit to the ownership and maintenance of firearms should have the right.
This isn't some old west fantasy thing, It's more of having the ability to protect me and mine. Barring firearms, well then I'd simply take up a sword or chainsaw..which are far messier and I don't need to paint my walls right now. I'm a firm believer in the Castle Doctrine.
Post by MERRY CROMBMAS! on Sept 23, 2012 1:05:26 GMT
If there weren't any, you wouldn't need one to protect yourself from them.
I personally don't have a need to defend myself from anything, I haven't even heard of a house robbery in my neighbourhood to this date. Why is that? Because guns and other stuff like that are depicted as wrong in my culture? Because we don't see an object whose sole purpose is to kill as something that "intelligent and mature" people should have?
I think there's some correlation with that.
Funny how I always though of the balkans as something incredibly primitive. Guess you lot have something to learn from us as well.
Also, who gets to say if a person is worthy of owning a gun?
Never said I needed one to protect myself from them. I'm not talking about going into a gunfight for shits and gigs. I'm talking about protecting myself, my family, and my home from intruders. It has nothing to do with if they have a gun or not, If I happen to have one I can end the mess a lot quicker and a lot cleaner, than say, bludgeoning someone with a wok.
Ok here's the thing. My house was broken into. And it had nothing to do with guns. We weren't home at the time. In fact there are more killings per capita from burglars using household items and things like baseball bats or tools, than using firearms during home invasions. Because Armed Robbery and particularly the use of firearms during, are heavily persecuted against. Higher penalties.
Yes America is a fucked up place, I'm aware of this. I'm not blinded by propaganda, and I have a hatred of jingoism. This is a matter of survival. Even being in the military hasn't changed that for me. I'd carry a sword with me everywhere if I could. But my state doesn't have permits for anything other than handguns. It's strange and a bit nonsensical.
So the matter isn't even really guns, really. It's simply the highest form of self-defence a private citizen can own. Create a level playing field.
If a woman is about to get raped, what would she rather have a rolling pin, a tanto, or a snub-nosed .38?
It's simply about stopping power, neutralising the threat as quickly as possible.
"A True Patriot Must Be Ready To Defend His Country From Its Own Government"
As a nation that's had a very volatile life, it seems appropriate for the citizen to have a means to wrest control from a crazed tyrant should it become necessary. Even descending down the line to more local matters.
Also, if you hate guns so much tell the Serbs and shit to stop selling them here.
Post by Sawslig Steve. And William. on Sept 23, 2012 12:10:21 GMT
I believe that those who possess the intelligence, maturity, and discipline required to commit to the ownership and maintenance of firearms should have the right
That is just subjective as hell.
I'm in the same position as Lester. Nobody here owns a gun. 'Cept farmers. I've been mugged before. I've been robbed before, too, and had my car broken into. Feel no need whatsoever to buy a gun. Like Lester said, if it's harder to get guns, then guns are less likely to be used in crime, then you don't have to buy guns to defend yourself from guns.
Your country is one that was basically built on guns. From the very beginning. As a result people take guns for granted there, can get them extremely easily, and begin to feel weirdly paranoid and naked without them. As for all that stuff about defending yourself from your own government, that's what democracy's for... Which is another thing Americans believe in unquestioningly.
Well what did you think when this has all happened to you? Pretty fucking unsafe right? or perhaps you're so fucking jaded you thought WELL IN THIS BEAUTIFUL NO GUN PARADISE WHERE I STILL GET ROBBED AT LEAST I CAN'T GET A WEAPON TO PROTECT MYSELF BECAUSE THAT IS WRONG. get bent.
Again, if it wasn't guns it'd be swords or butterfly knives or nunchaku. Also, if Europeans are so evolved to the point of not liking guns and fondling they're "wrong" Stop playing CS, Stop selling them to us, stop selling them to our enemies, which causes us to then produce more.
Also, Democracy in America is vastly corrupt (image that!) and the only thing that has any power is money. So the richest asshole or whoever has the richest asshole friends always wins.
Although the exception being how McCain fucked himself over by trying to have Palin as a VP that was some barnyard logic on his part.
Post by MERRY CROMBMAS! on Sept 23, 2012 17:21:57 GMT
Okay: scene one.
I get mugged in Croatia. I lose a whopping 10kn($2, I never have anything more than that with me because I simply don't have anything) and my ID. A credit card? Well, good for him if he manages to guess the PIN code or whatever it's called.
I get mugged in the US, and have a gun to defend myself! So I pull out the gun. What now?
a) The mugger pulls out his. We're both scared shitless and I think it'd be better if I simply gave him all I had. b) The mugger runs away. Good. I saved one hundredth of the cost of my gun. A very nice investment. c) The mugger thinks I'm full of shit and insists anyway. I fire a warning shot and he runs away. Good. A bullet costs the same amount of money I just saved. A very nice investment. d) The mugger thinks I'm still full of shit and even after the warning bullet he continues to approach me. Do I shoot? Yes? Okay, I shot his kneecaps. He's fucking pissed because he realised he's basically fucked with an injury like that and can't get medical care for it because he's probably wanted. He pulls out his gun and attempts to shoot me. Do I shoot him again? And kill him?
Either way this particular outcome ends badly for me. I either get seriously wounded or kill someone. The psychological scars I'll have till the end of my life were definitely worth it.
Someone breaks into my house in Croatia. Well, fuck. At least I'll get back whatever money or stuff that gets stolen from media coverage because that happens once in a zillion years here.
Someone breaks into my house in the US. I notice the lad making some moaning sounds because he finally found a fleshlight in one of his raids. I pull out my gun and go for him.
He can run away or risk injury or death. Based on his sanity, he may pick death. Good for me, I just killed someone! Too bad the amount of money I'll pay for my psychiatrist is probably going to be more than it'd ever get stolen otherwise.
A psycho barges into my house and kills my whole family in Croatia, leaving me alive. Oh well, parallel universe.
A psycho barges into my house and kills my whole family in the US, leaving me alive. Who the fuck gave him a gun?
tl;dr Even having a gun to defend yourself isn't black and white. A culture that praises a tool whose sole purpose is taking lives is going to have problems with crime rates and morality in general.
Post by Sawslig Steve. And William. on Sept 23, 2012 18:03:59 GMT
A culture that praises a tool whose sole purpose is taking lives is going to have problems with crime rates and morality in general.
I think that's actually a quote from Bowling for Columbine.
Totally right, though.
Well what did you think when this has all happened to you? Pretty fucking unsafe right?
Unsafe? Kind of, I guess. Shit happens. When I was mugged, there was four of them. Let's do what Lester did and pretend I was an American.
If I DID have a gun, what do you think I would've done? Do you think I would've pulled it on them? Assuredly not, firstly because if this is America then at least one of them will have some kind of weapon. Maybe pulling a gun will make them run off, but they were surrounding me. I wouldn't even have had time to shoot them. Probably they would've started beating the shit out of me the moment they saw me go for my weapon. Maybe pulling a gun will just piss them off. Maybe pulling a gun will make them pull out their guns, and suddenly this situation just got a hundred times worse. Probably my body ends up cooling in an alley somewhere.
Pulling a gun would be fucking stupid.
Even if I don't pull my gun, they'll find it while they mug me and then, hey, they have a gun now, and I've done my bit to support organised crime.
Simply? It's empty comfort. Maybe it'll make me feel safer (because I'm an American and I need that), but it won't do shit for me in reality.
For me, the absolute worse case scenario is that I end up shooting and killing someone. Even if it was a mugger, that means I get to live my entire life with that on my conscience. Now hey, maybe that makes me a pussy. Or maybe I just understand the value of a life. Probably those are the same thing where you come from. But I will never buy a gun, regardless of how many times I get mugged, because it's fucking stupid. It's an empty comfort and all I'm doing is funding a backwards industry; doing my bit to raise the number of lethal weapons floating around in my country.
As it was, I don't think they had weapons. I felt unthreatened enough to tell them to fuck off when they tried to take my phone. They seemed unconfident, and I think that's probably because they didn't have any guns.
Because it's really not that easy to get guns in my country. Because we're not obsessed with them and their place in our constitution.